Mike Rimmer spoke at length with roots music veteran ERIC BIBB about his life and beliefs

In the Civil Rights Movement, we saw the power of spirituals but we also saw the power of protest and soul music. When you think about people like The Staple Singers, everything blended together to become a statement. It seems that Bibb is very much working out of that same place. It's fascinating how different music forms are apt and suitable to either give hope or to issue a challenge so an artist can pick what he needs for that moment and Bibb is operating in that same way now. "Very well put!" Eric responds. "I think about people like The Staple Singers, who grew up singing church music and were on that circuit long before they had hit records. They were a family gospel group making a living and inspiring congregations in their area, and then that leap. It's the same leap that a person like Curtis Mayfield made using that church tradition and broadening it and using it as a communication tool to bring people together and motivate people to action. I'm sure they were criticised. I'm sure there were conservatives in their environment who thought they were going too far and making use of the Lord's music in an improper way. I'm sure they had to deal with that reactionary type of response from their own community.

"Many church singers who take the church music outside of the church community end up being viciously criticised but you're right; that robust music that sustained a whole community traumatised by slavery and what followed, that's the perfect music. Pete Seeger knew it and The Freedom Singers knew it. They knew that these songs have what it takes to rally people and to inspire people in the face of danger on the frontlines. That's what you want. You want something that's going to give you courage and you look to what's giving courage and the passion and you realise it's still applicable."

Eric may talk about how church musicians have been criticised when they've gone mainstream but he appears to be a man travelling in the opposite direction. He's established himself in the mainstream and is now just being discovered by the Church. I tease him that he's got it the wrong way round! Eric laughs and responds, "It's a very fascinating bit of personal history that you've tapped into! It's amazing because I've had the freedom, not being bound by a rigid church community, to discover my own voice in terms of expressing my faith and to integrate it into secular music. That combination of the profane and the sacred has always been controversial or something contested by people who will tell you that the two should never meet, basically."

It is true that since the rock'n'roll era, we have had plenty of church musicians who have stepped out beyond the Church and had internal conflicts. From Little Richard to Marvin Gaye and Al Green or even Aretha Franklin, this issue has been a challenge so has Bibb got it all sorted out? He laughs, "Personally I feel I've got it sorted out! Career-wise, as a professional dealing with some very specific markets, it's challenging, and I'm happy to say I'm seeing a change afoot. I'm seeing that with the quiet way of holding your own beliefs up high without ramming them down anybody's throat, you're kind of diplomatically saying: We are whole people. We have spirituality at our foundation but we're living in the world and we express ourselves centrally in the world. Combining that world - romantic love with love of the Divine - is not so easy to market but I think it's time for artists to claim their right to mix the two and not be cowed by that kind of fear essentially that has dictated that one choose. But as I said, I haven't been too bombastic about that. I've just gone about creating a repertoire on record and live on stage that has been accepted by people. I do get criticism. There are people who, you know; they do a little inquisition at the signing table at the end of a concert. They want to know where I stand because they're a little threatened by apparent disregard for those rigid lines. But more and more, even in strictly Christian music circles, I'm finding acceptance for doing what I do. And I think it's how you do something. I think you have to not be abrasive. I think you have to not judge people for their take on things and maybe their reticence to stretch the envelope. It's a 'watch this space' thing."

The problem with an artist taking that kind of stance is that it's very easy to get shot by both sides. You get shot by the Church because you're too worldly and you get shot by the world because you're too churchy. "Yeah, there you go!" he agrees. "You put it in a nutshell! I've certainly experienced that and it makes me laugh now because I'm fortunately experiencing more acceptance than not but it's been a long road. I can really sympathise with artists who have had to let go of certain associations and connections because the straightjacket just got too tight."

There are other ways that it would be possible for Eric to be placed in a musical straightjacket and that's when it comes to categorising what he does musically. Because he is black, it would be easy to just call him a blues singer but that would only be half the story. He responds, "Thank you for acknowledging that! It's been a hard road on whole, although I really felt compelled to go my own way because to pretend, musically, is really asking to be just thrown out of the game. It's apparent when someone is pretending. It might have been easier for me to be more influenced by those stereotypes. I could have tailored my repertoire even more towards what was expected perhaps because of that stereotyping. But again, what has the most impact is what's the most real to you as a performer. Even if it's gonna take some time convincing the world that this is a viable space for you to occupy."

He continues, "It's like Charlie Pride. We're here in Nashville. Years ago, I was interested in what was known as country music because I felt like the song was the most important thing. The song is king. I didn't want to get out there and just make 'groovy' music, I wanted to say something with a song and I felt like the country music market at least had that allegiance to the song. But as a black artist I didn't get very much encouragement pursuing that. I mean there was Charlie Pride back in the day but there were not many well known black so-called country artists; although it's a natural genre for black artists to be involved in."

He explains, "I'm saying that we're in a part of the world where everybody was listening to everybody's music. All of the soul artists/blues artists that I've had a chance to talk to from another generation told me they grew up listening avidly, with joy, to Grand Ole Opry. And all of the country artists that I've had a chance to meet personally told me that one of their greatest thrills, I'm thinking of people like Levon Helm from The Band, was to listen to the 'King Biscuit' album and Sonny Boy Williamson. And so these two communities and to a degree they certainly were segregated; but there was a lot of crossing over at least musically at ground level. To pretend otherwise is to distort what I consider is truly Americana music."

Even having made his point, in 2008, it is easier to be white and do Americana than it is to be black. It's much more acceptable. Eric agrees, "You're absolutely right. And here again is a role that I've taken upon myself, quietly but determinedly, to correct. I also felt that to call something Americana and not include the great African American traditions that have nurtured what has become known as Americana music is really just grossly inaccurate. Musically, historically and socially it's just another reflection of that unfortunate poison of racism that I think can be addressed without going to the barricades. I think as I said, musically, with certain determination and knowledge of the history of the music, you can basically pull people's coats to a fact that somehow in their hearts they know already; Elvis knew it, you know? So we just have to keep reminding ourselves because Americans as a culture fall back into the comfort zone, which is not really a comfort zone because we're never really comfortable with that segregated type of reality. But it does take a lot of courage to keep it in your face because it's got a lot of baggage attached. But I contend that now is a great time to really finally start to bring this out from under the carpet and one of the best ways is musically, because music is balm. It's balsam for the soul. And in that context these uncomfortable truths are easier to face."